ACKNOWLEDGEMENT OF COUNTRY

Intro music- WAVES MUSIC  

Rebecca Hubbard:

The actual value of the ocean, the ecosystem services, the livelihoods, cultural values that the ocean delivers are usually not factored into classical national accounting. Degradation of the ocean is actually a huge loss of value to society, and investments in conserving or even restoring ocean health are investments that deliver in the short and long term.

Jennifer: Hello and Welcome back to NEGOTIATING THE OCEAN – a podcast by the Australian National Centre for Ocean Resources and Security – ANCORS at the University of Wollongong. I’m Jennifer Macey.

Ina: And I’m Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki. This is a podcast about ocean equity at the international meetings governing the ocean.

Jennifer: You’re listening to part two of our mini-series shining a spotlight on the stakeholders who go to the Ocean Treaty negotiations. In our last episode we met Angelique Pouponneau, the lead negotiator from AOSIS which is made up of representatives of various national governments from Small Island States. But, Ina, if you’re not part of a government delegation, how do you engage in this process?

Ina: So, there are many different stakeholders who participate in these negotiations. They can be States, but they can also be intergovernmental organisations like UN Agencies, industry representatives, scientists and NGOs, like environment groups.

Jennifer: And today we will focus on civil society.

Montage civil society “We are the Seas!”

Ina: Today we meet one representative of civil society. I sat down with Rebecca Hubbard the director of the High Seas Alliance, a global alliance of NGOs.

Rebecca Hubbard:

Hello. I’m Rebecca Hubbard. I’m the director of the High Seas Alliance. The High Seas Alliance is an international alliance of over 60 member groups – NGOs and the IUCN. And our entire mission is to protect the high seas, or to achieve equitable conservation of the high seas. And we were established in 2011 and for around 13 years, we worked to get the BBNJ agreement negotiated and agreed…

Montage 2

[Montage of interventions of High Seas Alliance in BBNJ negotiations]

“Thank you, Madam President. And I am honoured to speak on behalf of the High Seas Alliance, […] and collectively represent millions of people around the world concerned with the future of the high seas.”

“Dear Mr. Facilitator, this is for the High Seas Alliance. It is encouraging to hear the support of many delegates for SEAs..And we also..”

“Relying on the existing framework is simply not enough to address the cumulative impacts of ever-expanding human activities: Fishing, mining, climate change and pollution. But it’s not too late to act. Madame Facilitator, this is a call to action and an urgent call to higher ambition.”

Rebecca Hubbard:

…and since it has been agreed, we’ve been focusing on now getting it ratified and entered into force and supporting countries to prepare for implementation. we have a website that basically has a series of resources where we summarize the key pillars of the treaty, we also talk about its relevance for protecting areas, and also how it relates to things like climate change or other international agreements. So, people can access that information really easily.

Ina: And can you give the, or mention to the audience a few concrete examples of how that treaty could advance ocean equity?

Rebecca Hubbard:

Sure, so in the high seas – or the areas beyond national jurisdiction – there’s a whole massive range of incredible creatures that have evolved over time to deal with their incredibly unique environments. And in each of those creatures, you know, there is, particular features like they have particular chemical makeups and abilities to adapt to those really distinct environments. And some of those features, their genetic code, can be used in other products. So, for example, pharmaceutical products, cosmetic products, industrial products. So essentially, we can take their incredible evolutionary skills and weave them into our human products.

But the reason why it makes a big difference for equity in the world – the treaty – is that traditionally, only really wealthy companies and countries have been able to access those resources because they’re so far from land, it costs a lot of money to get out there, it costs a lot of money to do the exploration. So, countries that don’t have those resources haven’t been able to access them and benefit from them. So, the treaty really aims to address that by both giving developing countries access to the non-monetary benefits, so the data. So, researchers could potentially access the data and the information and actually start doing their own research and development, whereas before they couldn’t access that data. And, also, some of the financial benefits. So, you know, we’re talking about resources that actually belong to everyone in the world and should be there for the benefit of everyone, but only some people have been really making profits out of them, so ensuring that a percentage of those financial benefits are actually redistributed to all countries and for the benefit of all citizens.

Ina: What would you say is important for this treaty to become a success?

Rebecca Hubbard:

So, the most important thing is that at least 60 countries ratify it so it can enter into force. Because if it doesn’t enter into force, it practically doesn’t exist. So that is the first step. I think the next step in terms of making it a success is universal ratification. So, the way that this treaty will be its most effective is if we have wide engagement from all UN member states. We really want inclusive participation, broad participation in the treaty in terms of having as many countries from all the regions ratified and engaging with it, then we will have the best chance of making it a success.

The High Seas Alliance, we work with many countries to support them in that process. And sometimes, you know, it can be as simple as providing a brief to the ministers of a cabinet. So, what we have found is that generally, lots of governments, ministries, parliaments don’t know much about the BBNJ agreement. So, one of the key and simple things to do is actually just do some very simple awareness raising about: Why is this treaty important? What are the benefits for countries? And how can they sign and ratify the treaty? And many are in the process of getting from signing to ratifying, because that is usually a bigger step in terms of investment in resources. But in that particular step, that’s where educating your parliamentarians, like those that maybe are in specific committees that need to approve the ratification, or providing briefings for ministers in cabinet who need to approve the ratification. You know, those kinds of things then, they’re not super difficult, but, you know, we’ve helped many governments with that information. So, it’s really just about engaging and also reaching out to other countries that have that have done it as well, not just civil society organizations, but other countries that have been through the process and getting support from them.

Montage

“A recent assessment by the Intergovernmental Science-Policy Platform on Biodiversity and Ecosystem Services has cautioned that the state of biodiversity and ecosystems of our planet is at its most paralis point in history and their decline is accelerating.  

This assessment also recognised that highly protected and effectively implemented Marine Protected Areas are one of the most effective ways to protect biodiversity. These leading scientists have pointed to the need for transformative change and the BBNJ agreement can be this transformative change for the ocean.”

Ina: The Preparatory Commission Meetings – or PrepComs- are happening in New York – to prepare the entry into force of the BBNJ agreement. Rebecca Hubbard describes how policy makers bring this treaty to life by designing and creating new institutions. And these new institutions will carry out the work of the ocean treaty – but what they will look like is currently still being decided.

Rebecca Hubbard:

So, the PrepCom meetings are really kind of like designing and building the system that’s going to basically help implement the treaty when it comes into force, right? So, all these things that we want to do, like create protected areas and share the access and benefits to marine genetic resources or analyse the impacts of potentially damaging activities. All of those things – we will need help in terms of having committees that can help ensure that that is done systematically by all the countries. And so, we need to design the institutions and the building blocks and the processes. And so that’s what the PrepCom will do. It’s got a list of committees that it needs to look at in terms of deciding on who the members of those committees are and what their rules of procedure are, like, how they will function.

And exactly what we can expect, I mean, there’s a very long list of work to be done, and it’s pretty comprehensive, but I think essentially what we need to see from the PrepComs is we need to see States focused on working out what needs to be designed to achieve the objectives of the treaty. So that’s really what their job is, like, keep the eye on the end game, which is implementation of the treaty, and what do we need to get there. How do we design these committees and these processes to make sure they can deliver those things? So that’s the challenge.

Ina;

So, this new agreement will establish some other bodies. Can you introduce us to those bodies and why they’re important?

Rebecca Hubbard:

Sure, so the agreement establishes six bodies. So, it establishes the access and benefit sharing committee, the scientific and technical body, the implementation and compliance committee, the Finance Committee, the capacity building and marine technology transfer committee, and the clearing house mechanism.

So, it has all of these committees, and each of them are really tied to a part, well actually, not just one part of the treaty, but actually, a number of them really apply across the whole treaty. So, they really are kind of, kind of like the horse and cart that’s going to carry the treaty forward. So, the scientific and technical body will be responsible for providing expert scientific advice to the Conference of the Parties. So, the Conference of the Parties is the decision-making body for the BBNJ agreement, and it will meet within a year of the entry into force of the agreement. And it is basically, empowered with making decisions. So, it will decide things such as, if there is a proposal for an area-based management tool or marine protected area in the high seas, it will decide on that ultimately. But in order to get to that decision, there is a number of processes that are identified in the agreement.

Ina: So, just a quick reminder – there are six bodies currently being discussed and designed to carry out the work of the Ocean treaty.

So there’s:

• The Access Benefit Sharing Committee
• The Capacity Building and the Transfer of Marine Technology Committee
• The Finance Committee
• The Implementation and Compliance Committee

And also,

• The Scientific and Technical Body
• And the Clearinghouse mechanism.

All of these are still being discussed in these meetings.

Rebecca Hubbard:

So, the scientific and technical body is really important, because it is tasked with providing expert scientific advice on things like marine protected area proposals or environmental impact assessments. The Clearinghouse mechanism is another very important committee or body, and, because one of the things that’s so special and important about the BBNJ agreement is that it really does promote transparency, access to information, the sharing of data, and that is a really big and important change in international ocean governance.

So, the Clearinghouse mechanism is, is this thing.. It could be a website, but it’s not really just a website, because it really needs people to run it, to put information in it, and then also to get information out of it. And it really will, you know, be the place where, you know, you might send data related to your marine genetic resource research at sea, or it will be the place that information will be deposited about potentially damaging activities that are being proposed at sea, and the environmental impact assessments for those activities. And so, I mean, that’s just a couple of examples. There’s really a lot of information that this Clearinghouse Mechanism is tasked with managing. So really, it’s got to be established. It’s got to be designed, how it works, how it’s going to be operated, how we’re going to put information into it, how we’re going to get information out of it. All of those things need to be worked out. And it’s got to work for all elements of the treaty, not just one part. And so that’s that’s a real challenge, because often with the BBNJ agreement, people look at it in like it’s four different pillars. It’s area-based management tools, or its environmental impact assessment, or its marine genetic resources or capacity building, but in this case, it needs to make sure that there is connection through all those pieces and all the Parties that are interacting with that.

Ina: And maybe from an ocean equity point of view, what would be very important in designing these bodies?

Rebecca Hubbard:

So that’s a really good question. I think that representation in all of these bodies is super critical to think about, like, who is in the bodies? I think obviously, geographic representation, as we talked about, you know, universal, just like universal ratification is important, geographical representation in all of these bodies is very important to ensure that those different perspectives are well represented and the different expertises are well valued.

Other things to consider are things like, like the transparency of those committees, how they operate, how they can be accessed. Resources, in terms of who has resources to be able to go and participate? Are they expert based, or are they country based? You know, are you representing a government and therefore a potential political agenda, or are you representing a technical expertise? You know, incorporating traditional knowledge into how we value knowledge and information and ensuring that that’s represented. Also, like how you select the members, right? So even just the process, so there’s a lot of things to be really considered.

Also, if they’re going to be making decisions in between the Conference of the Parties. Can they talk to other bodies directly, or do they have to go through the Conference of the Parties? Yeah, it’s kind of really working out a new ecosystem, and who are the species in the ecosystem, and how do they fit together, and what’s their relationship with each other, and making sure they talk to each other.

Ina: What are the challenges or opportunities for resource mobilization and funding? How can the funding for implementation of this treaty be ensured?

Rebecca Hubbard:

So, the actual value of the ocean, the ecosystem services, the livelihoods, cultural values that the ocean delivers are usually not factored into classical national accounting, which means that healthy oceans are not attributed a value. But exploitation, even when unsustainable shows up as value generation. So, taking this into account, degradation of the ocean is actually a huge loss of value to society, and investments in conserving or even restoring ocean health are investments that deliver in the short and long term.

So, in terms of, you know, common challenges for resource mobilization, the lack of dedicated funding has often been named as one of the reasons why the UNCLOS capacity building provisions have not been implemented to dissatisfaction of many states. But BBNJ has learned from that experience by building a dedicated funding mechanism through the monetary benefit sharing provisions in part two on MGRs.

Jennifer: A big thank you to Rebecca Hubbard – the director of the High Seas Alliance. We’ve a put a link High Seas Alliance website that Rebecca Hubbard mentioned earlier in this episode which has more information about the BBNJ.

Ina: We’ve also included links to the official UN documents that will be discussed during the PrepComs and some background information published by our ANCORS researchers.

In the last episode of our mini-series on stakeholders and BBNJ we’ll talk to Associate Professor Fran Humphries from Griffith University – an expert on Marine Genetic Resources and Benefit Sharing.

Jennifer We’d love to hear from you, so send any comments or feedback to our email address: inatvw@uow.edu.au

Jennifer – This podcast is edited by Emily Perkins and communication is by Sunnefa Yeatman.

Ina: Thank you also to ANCORS and the Nippon Foundation for their support for the making of this podcast.

Jennifer: I’m Jennifer Macey.

Ina: And I’m Ina Tessnow-von Wysocki.

Jennifer: Thanks for listening!

Ina: “Sea” you next time!